Former Jigawa State governor, Sule Lamido, in this interview, likened the All Progressives Congress, APC, leadership to Pharaoh?s. Lamido, who lamented that the APC has weaponized poverty against citizens, said hunger was now walking on the country?s streets on two feet. Excerpts;

Can you speak about the crisis the Peoples Democratic Party, PDP, has been facing for a number of years. What has been done to strengthen the party, reconcile aggrieved members and re-strategise for 2027?

I am really alarmed by your curiosity about PDP and your interest in the party. I was in Ilorin yesterday, and I had the same question from a journalist. I said, look, the PDP story is well-known by all Nigerians. What has transpired in the last two years is well-known. I think Nigerians know more than enough for them to be able to give us the peace to sit down, look at them internally and see how we can get the party properly reconciled. We have said so much about the party, there is so much noise, vilifying one another and I think it has now become a big monotony for Nigerians to be talking about the PDP crisis all over. Give us time now. We are now working very hard. We are reaching out to our various stakeholders, and please give us the time to reconcile ourselves. So much for the entertainment, so much for the controversy, so much for all the noise about PDP. I think it has been a big entertainment to Nigeria, a big entertainment about our crisis. Let us now at least sit back and see how we can really reach out to one another, reconcile and forgive one another and then give Nigeria a party that will lead it into security, prosperity and international reconciliation.

What would you say that the PDP needs to do in order to regain the trust of individuals who are not part of political parties, who do not have the cushioning of life as the political elite?

I don?t know. You see, the duty to hold the Nigerian government to account is that of all Nigerians, not only for the political party called PDP. It is true we are in opposition, it should be the main champion of the opposition, but then the Nigerian people have the power, the authority and the right to also hold the government to account. It is a collective thing for all Nigerians in the political parties. When you say PDP, I mean it is a very lazy argument because what are Nigerians doing? We can only be effective if Nigerians believe and trust us. In any case, we are coming from a background where we are a very powerful political party, we have been in power for some number of years and we are vilified, we are maligned, we are accused of a number of things. Why this study into our PDP and then playing a role which all Nigerian people play? So to me, the government of today is the Nigerian government, it is for all Nigerians and therefore should be able to collectively hold the government accountable. That is all. So when you place the role on PDP alone, the very party which Nigeria denied in the last eight years, it sounds a little bit unfair. It is an unfair expectation because people never believed in the PDP in the last eight years. They are simply talking about PDP because of the consequences of the choice they made in the last eight years.

Now, some analysts are of the opinion that Nigeria and Nigerians face a lose-lose situation in 2027, as it does seem like all the political parties, including the ruling party and even the PDP, seem to be lacking in ideology. It does seem like all political parties are only interested in grabbing power without any vision or idea on how to actually move the nation forward. Can you react to this?

Apparently, you are trying to provoke me. When you say PDP has no ideology, then why do you bother to ask me about our role if we have no Ideology? You see, I think we should be able to look at this in a more honest way. The country called Nigeria is a big leader in Africa and also in the world. Therefore, the role we play or do not play has serious consequences on our sovereignty and to the world in general. When you say we have no ideology, then why are you asking me if we have no ideology? If we lack ideology, then why are you asking me?

I?m asking you to react to what some critics are saying?

No, you are trying to provoke me into a debate which is simply unnecessary. Simple. The PDP has got a very clear history, which you all know, in the last 25 years. You know what Nigeria was in 1998, what Nigeria went through after the annulment. Therefore, the efforts of the PDP to bring Nigeria back to sanity, to unity, based on the consequences of the military rule we had. The PDP worked very hard and in 16 years, we were able to restore Nigeria, get Nigeria thoroughly reconciled and stabilised to the point that people were able to regain their vision, maybe, their conscience and their rights. Then they said, look, thank you PDP for what you have done. Now we don?t want you. We don?t need you because you are this and that. I mean, everything has been done today simply because PDP was the foundation of Nigerian stability. But then Nigeria said they didn?t like us. Now they have found out about the APC. Give us the chance, support and political peace to really look at Nigeria and then get the party properly reconciled and then work towards promoting a greater Nigeria of peace and stability and security. That is the thing, that is the way we?re trying to play now.

What special purpose vehicle can you foresee the North aligning with: Atiku Abubakar, Peter Obi, Nasir El-Rufai, Rotimi Amaechi, Senator Aminu Tambuwal and former President Goodluck Jonathan. Do any of these names jump at you as being likely candidates to do the job?

When you mention names also reflect into history. You see, what role have they played in bringing Nigeria together today? All of those you mentioned, the Ameechis, the Atikus, the Tambuwals, what was their role in 2014 in bringing the current APC government into power? These people you are talking about as key players, the El-Rufais, know their role. They are simply now coming to say we have done wrong. They are trying to regroup to talk to who? To me or to other Nigerians? What are they telling us? They are actually the entire problem. What are they telling us now? All of them, all the people you mentioned were all in PDP from 1998 to 2014. They are all PDP inventions, PDP creations. The people who are honoured, who are dignified, who are celebrated were invented by the PDP. PDP made them. But then they turned around and destroyed the PDP. Now, if they are coming around to talk about PDP, I have difficulty because I am coming from the old order where the issue of morality is very important to us.

I feel taken aback by some of their actions. But you know, this is what we are as leaders. I mean, picking and choosing what we want to do, what we think is best for our interest.

What is your opinion on the state of the nation?

Well, the government is making wide claims about security, economy and what have you, and the efforts in getting Nigeria secure and economically stable. The government should not be pontificating. Go to Zamfara. Go to Kebbi. Go to parts of Sokoto. Go to parts of Kaduna and ask people, are you safe? Do you feel secure? That is how you get the right answer from the people. Not somebody staying in Abuja and talking about Nigeria being very secure or safe. Second, on the economy, go to the market. Ask the ordinary bus driver, the ordinary folks roaming around the street. Ask them, are you happy with the money in your pocket? Is it able to give you what you think is adequate for your needs or not? To me, that is the parameter of testing either the security or the economy of the country. It is not about me or you, people like you, people like me, you know, who should be talking for Nigeria. Go to ordinary folks. Talk to them. Do you feel safe? Do you feel secure? Are you happy with the government? And answers will be given. They should drive down, they will see poverty walking on its own two feet. You see it. You can see insecurity. Last week, somebody called Turji puts a levy of how many million on some villages in Zambara, only last week. So when you say security and the economy and the government, to me, it is all part of the deception of leadership in government.

What more can ordinary Nigerian citizens do to demand and get good governance from the current crop of leaders that we have?

You see, the APC government has made poverty a weapon. Poverty has been weaponized. And therefore, when you don?t have the basic needs, when you are very poor, when you are hungry, you become very unstable. And so they have been able to create a situation whereby Nigeria will rely on what they call handouts or palliatives. The purpose of government is to create the kind of environment for Nigerians to be able to stand up and work and earn a living. But when you bring Nigeria into that kind of poverty and they rely on you for handouts, they have taken away their dignity, their self-esteem and even their capacity to be human beings again.

To me, the way forward is for government to be humane, to have human empathy, to also respect people and believe in their dignity, not by getting them subordinated and therefore feeling obliged for their support, which is their own right. Doing otherwise is simply creating an environment whereby I will feel obliged to feel maybe subordinated or to feel, you know, happy that the government is working for me. You don?t induce a problem and say this is the cure and ask me to thank you. You don?t do that. Government has been able to induce, you know, poverty and difficulty and it is not great for Nigerians. Because, you know, they have lost their self-esteem, their dignity, and their honour. And therefore, they now look to the government for succour and solace, which is very wrong.

I think the first thing the Nigerian people who are not very hungry should do is to resist this issue of handout during the election. You get noodles for your own vote because you are very poor. Now, make some sacrifice. Stand up for your rights. Stand up for yourself, for your dignity and your human essence. Second, the process should be able to also say we respect you as a Nigerian. Therefore, we believe in your dignity. We believe you have rights, you know. We should not manipulate or exploit you. It is something collective, you know. All of us must have that kind of human empathy, human feeling and human respect for one another. So that we will be able to create a very clean environment where issues can be properly addressed without any encumbrance from hunger or poverty.

For now, the Nigerian poor are burdened by poverty, hunger and they cannot see very clearly. And when you have no focus, when your vision is Impaired by this kind of problem, you don?t see very clearly. My worry is in 2027, what do we do to restore that culture of integrity, of sanity, and sincerity? So, you know, we look at the Nigerian situation and see how to save Nigeria? But by the way people are now being manipulated. The way they give out N50,000 monthly to people, I mean, you have taken away people?s sense of honour and dignity, and that is a big problem. It?s a very difficult thing to work under an environment where the leadership is so Pharaonic. The current leadership is very Pharaonic. It has no human empathy. It is arrogant. It is patronising. It is condescending. To them, government is owned by them, we are now a government of the oligarchs like America. What we see in Nigeria is a government of the oligarchs. How we restore power to the people is now a problem because the oligarchs are now in charge. (Saturday Vanguard)

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