President of the Middle Belt Forum (MBF), Dr. Bitrus Pogu, has noted that the Middle Belt can and will never be part of an Arewa Republic, if the latter becomes a reality.

In an interview with VINCENT KALU, Dr. Pogu, a member of the eminent Nigerians group, the Patriots, noted that if the country is restructured and a people’s democratic constitution is put in place, all the separatist agitations across the country will die down.

He also called on President Bola Tinubu to dialogue with the leaders of the last #End bad governance protest.

A northern group recently declared Arewa Republic, drew a map, hoisted their flag, displayed their coat of arm and sang a national anthem. What are the implications of this?

That is treason. We have funny characters up here in the north. When former President Buhari was in office, things were not moving fine; the economy was in shambles and they suppressed everything, and our northern brothers stayed mute. It went above board when Sanusi Lamido, as deposed emir, had to speak out that it was not right for just some few people to be enjoying the national economy, collecting forex at official rate and enriching themselves while others remained poor. These things happened during Buhari’s regime and none of them even made the slightest of noise.

Now, President Tinubu came up, I didn’t support him. My idea was that we should have a better Nigeria and we thought Peter Obi was a better candidate for that purpose. However the same people who were shouting, Muslim-Muslim ticket have now discovered that this man, in spite of his flaws, was not interested in dancing to the tune they were playing and heaven was let loose. In fact, before this protest, we got some information about destructive tendencies that were going to be unleashed on Nigeria. For what reason?

It means that anytime things don’t work their way, they want Nigeria to break up. It is unfortunate that we are still living with this archaic group of people who think that Nigeria belongs to them to dictate whatever they want and if doesn’t go their way; they flIng before us the threat of breakup. Nigerians are wiser now and we would not take it from anybody. Whoever it is and for what reason they are doing whatever they are doing had better stop because Nigeria has gone beyond that level.

We as Nigerians resist any breakup, but if they want to go their own way, they should be allowed. In fact, to us they have been a thorn in our flesh; they can go their own way and let’s have our better Nigeria for Nigerians.

You are a leader of Middle Belt. The map of the Arewa Republic shows that the Middle Belt is part of the new Republic. What is your position on this?

That is a joke. We will never be part of what they are planning. We are Nigerians and we have always stood for Nigeria and we will continue to stand for Nigeria. We belong to this country and through sweat we will build the kind of country that would be beneficial to us. So, we are not part of whatever they have planned and are planning. Who among them did what they did? It is up to them, and we are not part of it and would not be part of it. It is unfortunate that the people who have been dominating the political space are now the ones saying that they want to go.

There are some separatist groups now saying they don’t want to continue to be part of Nigeria. What do you make of such agitations?

Thank God that the Fulani, who people are running away from, now also want to go. If they are talking of Arewa; who are the Arewa people? Arewa has been and it is still being dominated by the Fulani people. As we are saying no to what they are saying, when the chips are down, I can tell you that even our indigenous Hausa would come to say, no. You can go, you met us here; we are indigenous to this land, you are the ones who came here about 200 years ago and if you feel you want to go your way, we are sorry that we cannot dance to your tune. So, it is unfortunate that the people who have been dominating the political space are now the ones saying that they want to go.

If you look at those agitating, it is because the Fulani have not given anybody a breathing space and that is why they are doing what they are doing. Otherwise, nobody wants to leave his house for somebody else. We believe and strongly too that all these agitations would stop when the group that has been a headache to everybody is no more a threat to anybody.

I believe what President Tinubu is doing, though painful, is helping us to move in that direction. Some people may not agree because of the economy problem. If we look at it, how did it start? Someone was there for eight years and the economy became so bad and we pretended as if there was nothing wrong. We know what happened during the elections and we were watching the political developments during the elections. Even the colour of the currency was changed for some reasons. Before the primaries of the APC, there were so many funny things that happened. In spite of all that, this man emerged as the president and some funny appointments took place. People who are not Muslims thought that they would be dealt with, but suddenly we now found out that this man has come out and has played the Nigerian game and things started to change. We should support what is there. The nature of the bad governance protest in the north is an indication that things are not the way they are supposed to be. So, let’s be focused and try to address the issues to ensure that things start working. Yes, there were agitations by different groups, but those agitations were agitations for a better share of the cake other than real separatist reasons.

I believe, whether it is Oduduwa Republic or whatever, when Nigeria starts operating as a true country, all of us irrespective of whether the person has Oduduwa or IPOB tendencies or whatever will fall in line and say, yes, we are Nigerians and we want to build this country.

The way forward is to restructure this country and to ensure we have a people’s democratic constitution so that people will have a sense of belonging and all the agitations from whichever quarter would die down and we’ll have a better Nigeria which we are advocating for.

The Patriots, of which you are a member, visited President Tinubu last Friday and demanded that he urgently start the process of having a people’s constitution. What informed this move?

I was part of the delegation. We believe strongly that Nigeria can be a better country for all Nigerians if we embrace the right kind of constitution and the reasons for our togetherness. Countries which are plural like Nigeria that ignored their plurality and adhered to strict constitutional rigidity broke up – Yugoslavia, Sudan and others are good examples.

Mr. President said he was going to passionately look into it with a view to addressing the issues bedeviling Nigeria so that we can have a better constitution that would address our plurality. Certainly, he said he would want to address the economy problem first before getting that done.

Mr. President has shown true interest and commitment towards ensuring that we have a people’s democratic constitution that will be able to address our myriad of problems caused by the kind of constitution we are now operating that doesn’t take into consideration our plurality and our diversity.

Leader of the Northern Elders Forum (NEF), Prof Ango Abdullahi recently called for a revisit of the 1914 Amalgamation Treaty to decide if the people want to continue to live together or go their separate ways. What is your take on this statement?

He may be part of the publication which we referred and to and which the Middle Belt has said they would not be a party to. When our Igbo brothers around the First Republic and all those coups decided to go their way, Nigeria fought vehemently to ensure that the country stayed together. It is unfortunate that somebody of his calibre would, for whatever reason, start beating the separatist drum. The truth remains, are we going to sit back and watch? When the Igbo were pushed to the wall and they decided to have Biafra and we went and messed them up. Up till today, the Igbo, a very progressive group known to everybody, are still being considered as second class citizens in their country. I don’t know how Nigerians will interpret what he has said. Time will tell whether a group can decide to walk away and we just sit down and watch or something else would happen.

I believe there are more people who believe in our unity than separation. For now, let’s just wait and see how things unfold. It is unfortunate to hear that kind of thing from somebody of that standing from the north.

The #Endbadgovernance protest put Nigeria on the edge. What do expect the government to urgently do?

During the visit of the Patriots to President Tinubu, this thing came up. The leaders of the group urged the government to engage the leaders of the protest in dialogue. The economic problems are real and addressing the issues at once is difficult, but there could be a way out. Maybe Mr. President lacks quality advice in addressing some of the issues. By dialoguing with the stakeholders of that protest, amicable solutions that would address the hunger in the country might be found. Dialoguing with the leaders of the protest is one way of addressing the issue raised by the protesters and in the activities which manifested during the protest.

There are now development commissions, but the North-Central has none? When would the region push for one to address the injury the zone has suffered over the farmers- herders clashes?

We are operating a fire brigade kind of system. Developmental issues in this country have been taken as a political statement, which shouldn’t be the case. Yes, there is need for something like that in the North Central, which is part of the Middle Belt. But the issue is how we should address the national issues that are bedevilling us.

Yes, for balancing and for ensuring that everybody in our plural society is taken on board, we can have and continue to have development associations here and there. But in real terms, we are not addressing the real issue because the real issue is that we are operating a system that is not in our balance, and devoid of addressing our plurality. Rather than using all these things, including of course, the issue of the Ministry of Livestock, which is a misnomer because the Oronsaye report says that we need to reduce the number of ministries rather than increasing them. All these things which are used as fire brigade approaches towards addressing some immediate problems would not take us to the Promised Land. Yes, I will want such a thing for the North Central Zone, which is part of the Middle Belt, but the truth remains that we need to restructure this country so that we don’t have to do some interventions but have holistic developmental approaches to issues rather than today, because these people are crying, you go and create development something for them. Tomorrow that side starts crying, you also address the same thing. It will never stop because of the fundamental problem of the plural nature of the country. We should have a kind of a constitution that can address our plurality and in the long run have a country where we can all say we belong and are proud to be part of it and not to be tearing it apart. (Saturday Sun)

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