Dr Mustapha Muhammad Inuwa, the immediate past Secretary to Katsina State Government, in this interview, he speaks on what the ruling APC may face in the 2023 general election, the crisis rocking the party in President Muhammadu Buhari’s home State.

Inuwa who was also past Chairman of APC in the state and Commissioner of Education among several other portfolios disclosed that the challenges of the APC in Katsina State are as a result of lack of purposeful leadership. He entertains fear that APC may suffer worse defeat than PDP experienced in 2015 with the prevailing hunger and insecurity in the country.

The former lecturer and ASUU Chairman of Usman Danfodio University also decried how money was used during the gubernatorial Primary election in Katsina to manipulate its outcome and how the party in the state is floating like a rudderless ship.

The three time Secretary to the Katsina State Government also beamed light on the current dimension used by bandits to make life miserable for residents in the state.

Why the beehive of activities around you, your campaign office despite losing in the governorship primary election?

Yes, Our campaign office is still more active, more lively with activities more than even those that are contesting despite the fact that we are not the ones with the governorship ticket because like I always said, primary election or any kind of election is just part of the process of political activities. Politics doesn’t start and end with election.

Of course, the ultimate is to elect leaders but the whole thing to me does not end there and by my nature, I’m always with people. I don’t know whether you have observed or noticed that even when I was in the office, I was always with people. You will find my office is always attending to people.

That’s why every morning, I go to the State Secretariat where people can always have access to me and I make sure I see all the people who came to see me before leaving around 6pm for my second office at the government house.

Why? If I go there, there are lots of restrictions so I choose to see people there at the Secretariat. When you come back to my house either in the day time or at night, I keep interacting, seeing people, sometimes till 1-2 am. So that’s in me. and this has been in me not only here in Katsina but even, when I was in Sokoto. Also, if I travel to Abuja or Kaduna before you know it, you will find a lot of people coming to the hotel where I stay and we discuss issues and politics in particular. So, I believe to some extent, This is what makes our campaign office what it is and we will continue with that.

The APC gubernatorial Primary has come and gone but what exactly went wrong in the process and why were you not returned as SSG?

First, about the conduct of the primary, I have no issue with that. People know what happened. It’s only unfortunate that in Nigeria we still allow things like this to happen; to use money in order to secure mandate which ought to be as a result of merit or commitment.

It’s very clear when the primary election was going on up to the time 31 out of the 34 local governments cast their vote, I was still leading with about 16 votes but those who feel threatened, those who feel very uncomfortable with me as Governor, most of them if not all are those within the government, organised themselves to see that that it didn’t happen.

They directed the other aspirant now candidate to ensure that money was brought to use the two or three remaining LG to change the direction of the election.

Initially, I didn’t believe it but it was later confirmed beyond any reasonable doubt that delegates were given one million naira each for 2 to 3 LG to make sure they vote for the person who eventually won the primary.

Honestly, the desperation was so bad, that one can afford to give a million naira to each delegate just to cast a vote, and you know once there’s desperation obviously, you know there must be motives behind such desperation.

Anyway, that doesn’t bother me as a person or as an aspirant because right from the beginning, we prayed for Allah’s choice and believe you me, there and then, I accepted the result. Infact, I was the only aspirant who stayed behind to greet and congratulate the winner declared and pledge my support.

Why I didn’t go back to the office as Secretary to the State Government

One-on-one, the governor didn’t ask me but already, I sent a message through some people who came to find out if I could go back and serve as the SSG, though I don’t know wether they were sent or just being overzealous.

I told them very clearly, I will not go back. One, that’s my third time of being the SSG. Like I told you, I served as SSG under the late Umaru Yar’adua’s administration as Governor. I also served in the first tenure of the Governor Aminu Masari led government for four good years, then I was reappointed for the second tenure and served for another three years. So I believe, all the contribution that I could have given, I believe I have done that. So, let somebody else also come and give his or her own contributions.

Besides, I wanted to rest and focus my attention like I told you earlier. So, I said okay, the remaining months, let me rest, let me devote my time more to my family, to my friends, to my religion and also to the little activities we are doing. I recalled the deputy governor telling me that that the governor told him that he wanted me to go back to the office but I refused. I told him honestly, I’m not going.

The governor didn’t tell me himself but the deputy governor and others close to the Governor told me. Some of them were even putting pressure on me but I told them categorically, and he (Masari) knows me very well, I stand by what I say and what I believe to do. So, I think that’s why personally he didn’t talk to me. I think that was why it took him a little time before he confirmed the acting SSG.

Let me take you back a little Sir, you said money was used to upturn the election against you in the last three local government. How much money do you think was used here?

One million naira per person. So in each LGA where they have 50-55 delegates. So, if you are talking about two local government, you are talking about a 100 people there about. Even before that one, the minimum they gave to each delegate was N500,000. Some gave N250,000. You get the point but the winner, the candidate gave a minimum of N500,000 and towards the end of the election, they increased it to one million naira to ensure that the remaining two local government voted for him and that’s why you see the margin is just Six-two 62 votes despite all these things.

Currently Sir, How would you describe your relationship with the Katsina Governor, Aminu Bello Masari?

It’s very cordial. We always speak when there is need for us to speak and whenever there is need for us to see we see. The only thing is that I’m not in government. So, I don’t go to the office but whenever the government is doing something that I am officially invited and I consider it to be something good for the state, I do attend. For instance, when we had this first August celebration, “Yauma Shukur”, I was there and if there’s anything the government is doing and I feel it’s important .. it’s my state and this still is my government because I was part and parcel of the coming of this government. So to me, we have a very good understanding, I respect him, he’s my leader and still my leader and boss. By all standard, age wise he is my senior, by social standard, he was number 4 in Nigeria and more again he was Governor and I was secretary which means he’s my boss.

Looking at the conduct of Primary election in Katsina and Nigeria generally and the perceived grievances generated in the course of the exercise, what do you think needs to be done to ensure a smooth primary. How can the selection of delegates be perfected to avoid list being fabricated or hijacked?

On the conduct of primary elections in Nigeria, there are peculiarities. So, the problems may not be the same and the solutions cannot be the same. First and foremost, the current primaries conducted in Nigeria, especially in APC was seriously, adversely affected by the new electoral law passed by the national assembly because it excluded those who are critical stakeholders in the system: the aged and enlightened, who can stand this kind of money issue. It also drastically reduced the number to a number that people can easily bribe. Take for instance, at the national convention, I understand many candidates gave $10,000 per delegates simply because the delegates were few. When we use to have over 10,000 delegates, tell me who can go and bribe this delegates with $10,000 each. The same thing here in Katsina, when Masari was elected in 2015, I think we had over 5000 delegates, but here now we have only 1800. So you can see.

Moreover, most of those delegates 99% of them are illiterates. They are people from the grassroots who were brought. All those ex- officio delegates were excluded. Governors, members of the state and national assembly were not there; party executives were not there. So, those who could even guide, direct or help sanitise the situation were excluded. In fact, they are not even supposed to be at the venue. So, the delegates were exposed.

The candidates were able to use money because like I said somebody could give a local government N50 million because they are only 50. How many persons can see a million naira and turn their face, especially in this kind of situation where people have multiples of problems to attend to. Some of them hardly eats, some couldn’t send their children to school, some have patients they can’t take to hospital, some wanted to give their daughters hand in marriage but they cannot afford because they have no money. Then somebody from the blues, just for you to cast your votes, ask you to take one million, an amount some of them never dreamt of getting. Tell me, how many people will resist that? So, that’s one. It seriously affected the system.

So, the way we do these our primaries generally is faulty. The party is not strong enough to ensure that the right candidate are there because most of the party leaders are not chosen by the people but are hand picked with the blessing of the heavy weight around the governors, ministers and those in government in particular. But if you allow the people to choose their political leaders, and you let them know that yes they are chosen by the people; they are not our boys; they are not our servants; they are not just answerable to us but to the general members of the party, it is only when that is done, then when primary election comes, they’ll also elect the people they want. Otherwise, as they are hand picked or appointed by the bigwigs, the same way those who come to contest for primaries will also be influenced by the same people. Is Just giving instructions to the party: “This is the person we want,” and they will declare him.

So honestly, we have to look at the way and manner things are done, including even the formation of the party, the party’s registration and the way and manner the parties are run.

We have to change and modify things. Let the democracy be truly democracy not by selection; throw it to the public, let them elect whomever they want to be chairman of the party. We should organise ourselves to always have primaries but because of corruption in the system we are always sceptical of direct primaries. We talk of logistics, we talk of security, we talk of so many things simply because we want to manipulate.

So, unless of course people are educated and enlightened and this problem of poverty is not there, then we can have a good modified direct primary election but as we are, honestly, it is very difficult with the few hands, to elect the person that is the choice of the people. That’s why in most cases, you find incompetent people that don’t have the capacity being used. They are not voting based on merit or capacity, No, this one belongs to so so and so big wig and that’s all. They throw away experience, capacity, and capability but settle for just personal loyalty.

What the party says is election should be held to select delegates, forms were brought, aspirants are expected to purchase forms before going to stand for election but that was not done. Rather forms were given to certain people to go and bring names of people they selected to be delegate and somewhere along the line, some people change the forms and the names. There are statutory delegates which this new electoral act excluded. So, it only allows those who were elected supposedly and only five per ward and then the election was not also held but it was just a selection.

Considering the numerous challenges bedeviling Katsina and the entire country under the current administration, do you think APC has justifiable reasons to expect Nigerians to vote for them come 2023?

This is the problem honestly, you see I always stay around, I hardly travel,even if I do, it’s just a matter of two days. It’s only when I go out of the country, maybe I stay for two to three weeks. I don’t think I have stayed four weeks outside the country in the last seven years or even more. So I’m always around and I interact with people on a daily basis in my house and in my office.

Honestly, people are not happy with APC as a party and the government of APC both at state and national level. This is the truth.

Like I said, I was past Chairman of the APC. I served as secretary to the governor for seven years. So naturally, I should want APC to succeed, to win, but the truth is, it is unfortunate really when APC came in as a government, there were a lot of expectations by the people. Infact, I would say unrealistic expectations. Many people believed that with PDP out and APC in all problems were considered solved but unfortunately APC as a government experienced a lot of challenges. Some internal, some global, especially issues to do with revenue. We relied largely on what we generate from the sales of oil and the price kept coming down.

Through out the PDP regime, I don’t think there was a time when a barrel of crude oil was sold below $140 but during APC government it was sold as low as $47 and so also the quota. PDP I don’t think there was a time they made below $2 million per day but APC there was a time it went as low as $500,000. So, you can see and then other issues of COVID and so on.

The issue of insecurity also persist especially in Northwest, North Central and to some extent, southern part of the country. These affected personal commercial activities of our people which in another way also extended to states because revenues were not generated enough from commercial activities.

So honestly, APC was not fortunate. A lot of things turned out contrarily to what people expected. So people are not happy. The life now, almost everything increases by three to four folds when you come to cost of living. Take for instance, the cost of a bag of rice, when we came on board, I think the 50kg bag was sold at about N8,000 per bag but now being sold at N33,000 in this area and at about N40,000 in Abuja axis. So, this is the same in almost every aspect.

The sources of income has also gone down and people are not even getting money to buy any more. It is one thing for cost of things to be high and people can afford it and it is another thing when things are high and unaffordable. So many people honestly live without food, can’t take their children to school, can’t attend to their health challenges.

All our commitments have become in many cases impossible to meet and the issue is even worst especially in this part of the country. In Katsina and other states in the northwest people have lost hope in the government and the security agencies to tackle the situation.

So, honestly, people are not happy and unless of course something radical, something serious happens especially to do with this issue of insecurity, high cost of living from now till election, it will be extremely difficult if possible for APC to win.

You see we held local government election in this state. You know what happened. So it was a pointer. That is why I believe the candidates, the party, and the government must put head together to bring all critical stakeholders to tell ourselves the truth and see what measures can the government both state and federal level do because there are things that the states can do but most of the things are with the federal government to do. Otherwise, what happened to PDP in 2015 may repeat itself to APC in 2023.

Are you satisfied with the measures taken against insecurity?

Since I was in government, I said this several times at different fora either at meeting time in the state or at meeting time with security agencies at federal. Honestly, the way and manner the operations are going on, can never see to the end of these problems. They may not like it but I’ve said it several times. You see, there is no synergy in what they do, especially the ground troop. I was on reconnaissance tour with the Air Force, we have gone round this forest, we have seen how it looks like, we have seen that it is some where you can penetrate, it’s somewhere you can see; it’s not as difficult as thick as rocky as we can have problem with maybe in Sambisa and other similar forest.

What we are asking this people to do, first and foremost, let there be a very strong ground troop and let this operation be done simultaneously.

We said it severally, there is no basis to have operation in Katsina while Zamfara, Kaduna, Kebbi, and Sokoto are not doing at the same time because it’s almost one forest. If you push them (bandits) from here, they will run there. If you push them from there, they will move there. But if it is carried out simultaneously from Zamfara, Katsina, Kaduna and to some extent Kebbi with support of the people of Niger Republic together with the ground troop and the air troop… but t is never done. We have said this several times without number but they are not willing. They (troops) don’t even penetrate. Let me tell you, hardly they go five kilometers into the forest. They are always within the main roads, the periphery. Not only that, quite a number of them have compromised. You see them engaged in farming and other activities in our area. One of them I understand last year was able to produce about two hundred bags of soya beans with bandits lurking around in the area.

If every security agency, the customs will do their work, the immigration will do their work, you understand, the NDLEA for instance most of this hard drugs brought to these bandits are brought from outside and believe me, quite a number of the things they do, without these drugs, they will not.

Even if we say we don’t have enough security agents, how many are the bandits? The entire bandits in this country I believe are not up to 100,000. Our security agencies put together may be about a million. So, you cannot tell me with air and ground troop, if these people are to do what they are supposed to do with good synergy, command and cooperation from the political leaders, that is the governors, with all of them having the same policies, things would have been different by now.

The communities too have a major role to play. They know somebody who is within the military who has no serious business doing, whom they know what his legitimate earning is but he is busy living much much higher than what he is supposed to be earning in their community but they can’t query or call him out.

So honestly, it is the combination of many problems but largely, the security agencies takes larger part of the responsibility of tackling this issue.

Still on insecurity Sir, In a recent BBC interview with Dr Bashir Kurfi, the elder alleged that schools in rural areas have been abandoned and converted to camps by bandits. How true is this?

Yes, it is true. Who will go there? Yes, schools and dispensary. There is no way the communities can run the schools and dispensaries. The bandits are the lords’, they are the authority. In some places they are even using mosques. They control the communities. So, what can the communities do? These people are heavily armed and under the influence of drugs and most of them are young and have not attained the age of maturity. So, what are they going to do?

Initially, when we had that amnesty program, part of what they requested was for us to build schools for them.

In the first year, we built ten primary schools and ten dispensary but I believe all of them are now turned into camps. When we went to Shimfida Community some years back while we were planning for the second phase of the amnesty, one of the bandits, called Dangote, I was told was staying somewhere very close to where we were but he refused to come. When I was told he didn’t want to come, I asked a motorcycle to take me to where he was.

I met him with about 30 young men all armed in one of the schools about three kilometers from the venue where we held the meeting with the other bandits who agreed to come.

I asked him to go and see the governor but he entertained fears. So, I said okay, I’ll wait here with your boys, you go see the governor, discuss whatever you want to discuss with him. If they allow you to come back, your boys should allow me to come back but whatever happens to you there let it happen to me here.

That’s just to confirm that many of these schools are taken over, many of our hospitals, clinics are taken over, including farm houses built by some individuals for storage.

They are all taken over, they are the Lords. They come to the town, do whatever they like. Sometimes, they even kick people out and sleep in their houses with their wives. Yes, it is so bad. People are facing serious problems. they will come an announce and order them to go out.

Presently, the worse situation is happening around Jibia, Batsari, Safana and then now in Dutsinma township and some villages around almost on a daily basis. Also, what they (bandits) do now, they no longer pick people and ask for ransom, they will come and announce to your village that okay: “we give you one week, make sure you generate two,three or four million naira (depending on what they want.)

We give you one week and within this one week no one is allowed to go to farm. Make sure you generate it and if you don’t, after this one week, whatever happens to you don’t blame us.”

So, as a result, people have become poorer. They have lost all they have. They have sold all they have to give these bandits.

Amongst the governorship candidates who do you think is most prepared to lead the state? Would people vote candidates or party?

I think what is important, is not the issue of the candidates but the party that is likely to win because you may have a very good candidate in a party that cannot win election. For that, no matter how good he is, no matter how confident people are in him, he cannot win the election. You need structure to win an election. You need support. There are things that certainly you have to have. It’s not just the issue of the individual, the party also is important. You see in Katsina you can say there are three strong candidates in terms of party and also individuals.

APC is on ground because it has government at the state and local government level and has all the structures in the party. PDP also have being in Katsina since 1999 and was in government for 16 years and now in opposition for seven years. Moreover, they have structures all over, they have candidates in all the constituencies. The next one is the New Nigeria Peoples Party NNPP whose candidates are known.They have the exposure, the qualifications and you can say the experience. But I don’t think wether NNPP has the structures in all the constituencies across Katsina State and even if they have, in some places they are just candidates put there because they just have to be there not because they are very strong.

However, I don’t think the election in 2023 will be largely on party basis. You may have people elected from different parties depending on who is there in that particular constituency. But for governorship like I said you need a structure. You need to have critical people who can support you and so on. But you can even win the house of representatives and state assembly election in a party that’s not even known;

However, for governorship, honestly, you are talking about 34 LGs, 361 wards, and over a thousand polling unit. So, it’s not easy to say any party can win gubernatorial election. You must have structures across board.

Recently, a reconciliation committee was set up in the state to reconcile aggrieved APC members. Do you think the committee will make any headway?

I heard about it. I was never told. I am not in the state reconciliation committee, I am not there but I have seen some aspirants in the committee. So, I don’t know what yardstick was used in constituting the membership but certainly I am not among. And I believe up to this moment I am talking with you, I have not told anybody that I have left APC.

So, I am still an APC person because in the federal constituency list, I have seen my name there with Mustapha Bala Batsari as Chairman and

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